Replacing broken keys on Nord Stage 1 76

[rocketman]

I have a classic Nord Stage (1) 76 that has a few broken keys. It's broken at the bottom of the key so it doesn't trigger the note right. The velocity is off. (full velocity or nothing at all). I opened up the unit and it seems the left side of the Keybed is cracking.

My question is this. Can individual keys be replaced on the TP40 keybed? Or do you have to replace the whole bed? Secondly how much does it cost to replace the full TP40 kb and where can one buy that part?

Thanks!

[mjbrands]

Fatar (the maker of the keybed) does not sell parts to end-users. You have some companies that do however, like Doepfer in Germany; I don't know if they still stock Fatar parts (since they don't produce their Fatar-based MIDI controllers anymore), but you could send them an email about it.

You could also contact keyboard repair shops; they can likely sell you single plastic keys to replace broken ones on your Stage. You'll also find those on eBay (and sites like craigslist?). You can probably even find complete TP40 keybeds on eBay, but you never know for sure what you get - it might be even more broken than what you have.

You might want to start with getting a quote on having your whole keybed replaced via an official repair center; they might be reluctant to give you a quote, so it may need some convincing from your side to get one. And even then it'll be an indication, as they might run into stuff that increases the repair cost.

You mention the PCB is cracked on one side: there is a chance it can be repaired (well, repaired is overstating it - 'made to work' would be more accurate). The PCB is probably fairly simple (single or double sided, fairly wide tracks) and you could likely bridge cracks in it by soldering on jumper wires, etc. The hardest part would likely be bracing it so it can take the pressure of playing it, even though it is structurally damaged and weakened.

One possible source of a donor keybed could be another, potentially broken, keyboard that just happens to use the same keybed. The Studiologic VMK176 (there are different versions, some include a sound engine while others are mere MIDI controllers) is a likely candidate.

I've never seen the Fatar weighted keybeds up close, but in the case of the Stage 2 SW 73 (waterfall, not weighted) it actually has a 76-key Fatar semi-weighted keybed with bits ground off at both ends to fit under the wooden end caps (Fatar likely doesn't sell a 73-key version). Using something like a Dremel, you would be able to modify an existing 76-key version to have the same modifications as the ones Clavia uses have. I have no idea if they made any modifications to the 76-key weighted keybeds, though I suspect they haven't.

[rocketman]

Thanks for the advice. The PCB isn't cracked fortunately but it's part of the key frame that's cracked a little bit. I'm not sure if that's affecting anything. I was just playing it too hard I guess (?).

I heard that the original Nord Stage 76 had a different keybed than the later Nord Stage 2 weighted keyboards? Or is it the same TP40. Maybe something else around it had changed. Curious if anyone knows.

I would think that just replacing a few keys would be inexpensive and I like the idea of that! I shutter at what a whole keybed might cost. But taking one out of another less desirable board that has a TP40 is a good idea... as long as it'll fit!

[mjbrands]

Thanks for the advice. The PCB isn't cracked fortunately but it's part of the key frame that's cracked a little bit. I'm not sure if that's affecting anything. I was just playing it too hard I guess (?)

You must really have been going at it

These keybeds should be able to take quite a beating, but they're certainly not indestructible.

I heard that the original Nord Stage 76 had a different keybed than the later Nord Stage 2 weighted keyboards? Or is it the same TP40. Maybe something else around it had changed. Curious if anyone knows.

Finding someone who knows for sure is a bit of an issue; the rest of us heard from someone's cousin that she knew someone who read on the internet that they used the same keybed - if it is on the internet, it must be true, right?

The most important thing would probably be the height. The width of the keys is generally standardized, as are the connectors for the Fatar keybeds and the aftertouch strip. However, if the replacement keybed were too high, it wouldn't fit. If it were a bit lower, you could increase the height by putting some metal spacers (or even wood) beneath it. The mounting holes might differ. The semi-weighted keybed on the SW 73 has a plastic frame, but if the weighted one has a metal frame like the one (TP40) in the picture below, that shouldn't be too much of an issue.



Does your keybed look like this picture?

Another user placed some photo's in this thread: http://www.norduserforum.com/nord-stage ... t2770.html

He had a NS Classic. Note that in the top photo you're looking at the right side of the keybed. With that in mind, it does look rather like the TP40 picture I posted above.

[rocketman]

Hmmm. I'll have to take a picture and post it. I think I might try to get a Fatar 76 key keyboard and swap the beds just to see if that does the trick.

It's funny that you say that I must have been going at it because I was traveling on a gig and rented a Nord Stage only to find it had the SAME problem with one of the keys. It starts with the velocity response not being right - where you hit it lightly and nothing happens then you hit it harder and you get FULL velocity. After opening it up and looking inside it appears that the part of the key that touches down on the velocity sensing rubber underneath is very particular. But I am curious if just simply swapping out a key for a new one fixes it... or if you have to mess with it, adjust it and get it in there just right. After seeing it happen a second time it almost scared me away from the Stage completely. However, I love it and want to get the 76 fixed. Luckily I have a Stage 2 as well that I'm taking very good care of and knock on wood (or plastic) I haven't had any velocity or key not triggering problems with it.

I also heard that the keyboards are VERY sensitive to dust so the dust cover is a smart move. I'm using it on the new one.

[bdodds]

If you haven't, shoot a note to Pablo Mastodon, our US support guy, he may have some ideas about this.

[mjbrands]

where you hit it lightly and nothing happens then you hit it harder and you get FULL velocity.

Sounds like a pretty standard velocity-issue: depending on which of the two contacts doesn't work you get a different result, one of them being what you describe.

After opening it up and looking inside it appears that the part of the key that touches down on the velocity sensing rubber underneath is very particular. But I am curious if just simply swapping out a key for a new one fixes it...

It won't fix it, not with the problem you describe. You could try it, since with a few exceptions (the keys at either end of the keyboard) the keys are the same: to be more precise, D4 is physically the same as D5, E4 as E5, etc. The keys often have a letter and a number stamped on it and if you for example check D4 and D5, you'd see it has the same letter/number combination. Some keys such as the highest C might physically be different (extra wide) since there is no C#.

The key is the (usually) plastic thing that hits the two rubber contacts underneath it - with what you describe, there's a problem with one of the two contacts.

After seeing it happen a second time it almost scared me away from the Stage completely.

This is not a Nord specific issue, pretty much all keyboards use a mechanism like this and can thus be impacted by this issue. Some keybeds might be more sensitive/prone to this issue, but Fatar keybeds are widely used and because of this you're just as likely to have this issue with a Kurzweil or Access Virus, for example.

I also heard that the keyboards are VERY sensitive to dust so the dust cover is a smart move. I'm using it on the new one.

Large amounts of dust is surely not good for them, but the cups are constructed in such a way that you can have some dust in them before they get issues. It is often debris a bit larger than dust that causes issue, such as (for example) a very small piece of paper that gets between the cup and the circuit board with the contacts. Keeping the room in which your keyboards are sitting fairly dust-free is probably more effective than using a dust cover. Still, I've always used dust covers, even if just to keep the hairs from my cats out of my stuff.

I am a bit confused now though: I thought you had physical damage to one side of your keyboard? But above you described a velocity issue, which is inconvenient but at least it (usually) means that it is just a bit of dirt, not damage to your board causing the issue.

[rocketman]

I wish it was just a bit of dirt. It seems to have to do with the bottom of the particular two keys that have this problem. The crack on the end of the key frame may not be causing any problem at all... although it does look like it could lead to more problems. I think I'll take it apart and snap a few pics. I'd love to get this working. Thanks for the help! Much appreciated.

[pablomastodon]

Rocketman,

You may have cracking and you may have intermittent velocity problems on a key, but they are almost certainly not related. The full velocity issue is dirt -- this is located BENEATH the rubber contact strip and will not be cured without removing that strip and cleaning underneath there.

As far as cracking goes, that is pretty unusual. Pics will help. If you'd like to give me a call I can assist with advice on opening, etc.

Bless,

Pablo
Nord Tech Support USA/Canada
800-994-4984 x3030
813-644-8480