Stage 4 Song Mode ?

[Al_DeKlein]

Those of us that have incorporated Setlist Mode as an important part of our workflow are likely feeling similarly about the Stage 4 as Stage 2/EX users that were challenged in their workflow by the removal of Pending Load and certain MIDI features in the Stage 3.

As someone who uses a lot of splits/layers and multiple programs per song, I’m pretty sure that I would end up buying a used NS3 (assuming new units were no longer available) should anything catastrophic happen to either of my NS3s in the near future. I couldn’t see spending the extra $4,000+ to move to two NS4s, re-create hundreds of programs, and figure out a new workflow and layout for many of the songs my band plays.

I’m really not needing anything that my NS3s can’t do and I don’t need extra equipment to run them. I still get the “wow” feeling every time I turn them on, even after 5 1/2 years, and I can create the sounds I need. I guess it’s a relief that the NS4 is not a must-have upgrade for me. If my DX7-IIFD, SQ-80, S-50, and Proteus-1 all lasted 25 years, I think I can hold out for another 6 years with my NS3s to see what the Stage 5 brings to the table and what my needs are at that time.

[cphollis]

I too was very committed to Song/Setlist mode on the NS3. And the thought of re-organizing my workflow for over a hundred presets is daunting indeed. That being said, I'll be (slowly) transitioning from the NS3 to the NS4 during this year.

I did have to get my head wrapped around the idea that presets now really exist at the section level, and you then combine them into programs/songs and vary the mix with the new level faders. It leads to a different style of playing than before, which I am looking forward to. But that will take some time. Unlike @ajstan, I don't use lots of programs per song nor a lot of splits, so my task will be much easier than someone who has really tailored their NS3.

[cliff]

For me, the current organization would be fine if only I could name each set of eight buttons. Then I could scroll through a list to the appropriate set of programs. I don’t want to go to the tablet route because I use that for charts and sometimes move to a chart before we start the song so having it emit program change would break everything. Furthermore, having the tablet rely on the current organization of sounds within the Nord would really be a pain, I’d have to make each change in two places.

[cgrafx]

For me, the current organization would be fine if only I could name each set of eight buttons. Then I could scroll through a list to the appropriate set of programs. I don’t want to go to the tablet route because I use that for charts and sometimes move to a chart before we start the song so having it emit program change would break everything. Furthermore, having the tablet rely on the current organization of sounds within the Nord would really be a pain, I’d have to make each change in two places.

i don’t know what software you are using for your charts, but “onsong”, which is the chart software I use! doesn’t have to send a program change when you change charts. you can do that manually separate from the chart change.

if your organizing songs on your tablet, you don’t have to organize your songs on your Nord (leave them alone).

[SuperStage]

For me, the current organization would be fine if only I could name each set of eight buttons. Then I could scroll through a list to the appropriate set of programs. I don’t want to go to the tablet route because I use that for charts and sometimes move to a chart before we start the song so having it emit program change would break everything. Furthermore, having the tablet rely on the current organization of sounds within the Nord would really be a pain, I’d have to make each change in two places.

i don’t know what software you are using for your charts, but “onsong”, which is the chart software I use! doesn’t have to send a program change when you change charts. you can do that manually separate from the chart change.

if your organizing songs on your tablet, you don’t have to organize your songs on your Nord (leave them alone).

Thanks for this. I use OnSong and this will be a good solution to replace song mode until Nord (hopefully) releases an OS update to provide an onboard solution.

How are you connecting your iPad to your Nord? Has anyone used the CME Widi system to connect an iPad directly to a Nord?

[PScooter63]

As someone who has controlled patch selection via tablet for many years (prior to acquiring my S3), I never saw the need to embrace Song Mode, because my solution is platform-agnostic.

I happen to use ForScore, which allows MIDI messages across multiple channels on selection of a title, as well as embedding as many “soft buttons” as I need for a given song… no 5-patch limitation. I’m sure the other packages mentioned are similarly capable, I just landed on ForScore first.

Not to judge the Song Mode lovers out there, but consider the difference between built-in navigation in your vehicle, versus CarPlay/Android Auto…. the latter is vehicle-agnostic in the same way a mobile device would be for your rig.

Solve it once, and you will always have it regardless of the instrument… specific program channel number assignments aside, anyway. But that’s fairly trivial to manage, too.

[Valpurgis]

Solve it once, and you will always have it regardless of the instrument… specific program channel number assignments aside, anyway. But that’s fairly trivial to manage, too.

The beauty of song mode for me is to avoid that tablet/laptop administration including external psu and cabling and need for safe placement. That makes room for a cup of coffee while the guitarist set up his pedals and tunes the guitar.

[cliff]

I thought of another way to organize sounds on the Stage 4. The leader of the band I play with frequently requests multiple sounds for verse and chorus and other. Where on the NS3 I used multiple programs for a song, the NS4 layer features frequently makes this unnecessary but there are cases where it would be too confusing or impractical to do this during a song. A possible (but flawed) solution is to use a program strictly as a title.

For example A11 would be named 'Song Title' and A12-A18 could contain the other programs needed by the song. A11 doesn't have to be empty, it could also hold a sound, but you couldn't quickly glance to see what it was since the name is the song title. I recognize that this is a variant on the previously suggested solution of having each program have a prefix that identifies the song, but there just aren't enough characters to do that in some cases.

I'm honestly not sure I'll use this scheme but wanted to mention it. I'm bummed about the lack of titles for a group of programs but in every other way I'm really thrilled with the NS4 and am definitely keeping it. I'll be selling my NS3 compact just as soon as all of my programs are reset on the NS4.

[cgrafx]

For me, the current organization would be fine if only I could name each set of eight buttons. Then I could scroll through a list to the appropriate set of programs. I don’t want to go to the tablet route because I use that for charts and sometimes move to a chart before we start the song so having it emit program change would break everything. Furthermore, having the tablet rely on the current organization of sounds within the Nord would really be a pain, I’d have to make each change in two places.

i don’t know what software you are using for your charts, but “onsong”, which is the chart software I use! doesn’t have to send a program change when you change charts. you can do that manually separate from the chart change.

if your organizing songs on your tablet, you don’t have to organize your songs on your Nord (leave them alone).

Thanks for this. I use OnSong and this will be a good solution to replace song mode until Nord (hopefully) releases an OS update to provide an onboard solution.

How are you connecting your iPad to your Nord? Has anyone used the CME Widi system to connect an iPad directly to a Nord?

I'm not a fan of using anything wireless that doesn't need to be. I'm using an iConnectMIDI2+ (https://www.iconnectivity.com/products/ ... tmidi2plus). Important detail for this was if you use the external power supply it will charge your iPad. I did also end up having to purchase iConnects iPad cable as I couldn't get 3rd party cable to work.

I then mounted the box with a small camera quick disconnect to my keyboard stand.

iConnectMIDI attached to keyboard stand 2

IMG_2139.jpeg (3.09 MiB) Viewed 962 times

iConnectMIDI attached to keyboard stand 1

IMG_2143.jpeg (4.57 MiB) Viewed 962 times

[PScooter63]

Solve it once, and you will always have it regardless of the instrument… specific program channel number assignments aside, anyway. But that’s fairly trivial to manage, too.

The beauty of song mode for me is to avoid that tablet/laptop administration including external psu and cabling and need for safe placement. That makes room for a cup of coffee while the guitarist set up his pedals and tunes the guitar.

To each his or her own, I suppose. I use a Yamaha Bluetooth MIDI dongle (program and control changes only), and I ensure my tablet is fully charged the night before. I’m typing this on my iPad Pro 13”, and after a 3-hour gig tonight, it still has 76% of its power capacity. So, no cables or PSUs for me, I agree that would be a hassle.

As far as placement is concerned, my band uses a lot of custom written arrangements, so I’d have a music desk anyway. I’m totally paperless at this point.

So when I get to a gig, I plug the BT MIDI dongle into my Nord along with sustain, rotor, control pedals, and of course audio cables. I open my tablet, fire up a freeware app that serves as the “go-between plumbing”, which takes maybe 15 seconds… open ForScore, pick the song, and I’m off.

Oh and a PageFlip Firefly too, which is also Bluetooth’d to my tablet. No, the two devices do not interfere with each other.