Stage 4 Song Mode ?

[zippo]

Unfortunately Nord Stage 4 without song mode is almost useless on Stage. LOL

Reading all the complains in this thread, I wonder how could millions of professionell keyboard players for decades do their jobs until 2015?

[NordFR64]

If you don't mind burning a lot of patch space, you can organize patches similar to Song mode (albeit without naming each Song).

On the NS4 we have 8 programs per bank.
I've never needed more than four patch changes per song... so I arrange each song like this:

"Song 1"
1-2-3-4 (patch buttons)

"Song 2"
5-6-7-8 (patch buttons)

Instead of using the Program dial to select the next Song, I use the Bank Button.
Each bank contains two songs.

At a gig, this method is pretty close to the NS3's Song Mode.

Hello, I am moving from an NE6 to a NS3. I must admit I was quite used to the programs as used in the NE6, and I was using them exactly as Jim describes it. For me, it was perfect.

Now, moving the NS3, I can't see the advantage of the song mode, it is even the opposite for me : it adds complexity ! I would have appreciated that a song could memorize some parameters like transpose or some effects. But the song is just a pointer to programs that are stored in any order. I really found the NE6 organization easier to use, even in gigs. Moving from one "song" to another was just done by pressing the page > or < and that's it. And it was very easy to modify a song, you are directly in the program, actually. As in the NS3, you have to get out of the song mode, save your changes, and then go back to song.

However, modifying a setlist is easier with the song mode, this is an advantage over the "program only" organization (where you have to move blocks of 4 programs).

[StuartR]

Unfortunately Nord Stage 4 without song mode is almost useless on Stage. LOL

Reading all the complains in this thread, I wonder how could millions of professionell keyboard players for decades do their jobs until 2015?

I agree. It's been years now since I relied on any keyboards' inherent patch "management", having switched to using one of many available software tools that run on all tablet and laptop platforms.

[Zivanovitch]

Unfortunately Nord Stage 4 without song mode is almost useless on Stage. LOL

Reading all the complains in this thread, I wonder how could millions of professionell keyboard players for decades do their jobs until 2015?

I was one of those millions of professionals who played without having the "song mode" function, but when it came into existence it became extremely functional, for me, and I believe for many. The deletion of this attribute in Stage 4 was a disappointment. I simply like the practicality of "Song Mode" within the Nord. Besides, I'm too old to add weight to my stuff, as laptop or even an Ipad.

[mrgkeys]

one of the biggest changes of not having a song mode, is that small tweaks on the same song from set to set, now have to be copied to each one. For road work thats really hard to find the time to do, as it's packing up and moving asap to the next show. What ever changes I make to the single patch in the Stage 3, shows up in every set that patch is in. I rotated my Stage 3 back into use last week (85 different songs, 4 different Sets) and put the Stage 4 into storage. Pulled all the new V6 samples over as I prefer the V6 pianos and eps especially the Wurlitzer thats now in tune in the lower octaves. I've been fighting the gtr player since 2006 with that one. Nice to have my V3 sample library back. Also immediately loved having the no external zone with program changes back to control other keys per song. Nord even took that out of the newest revision of the manual. I missed some of the extra effects, but it's not a game changer. Might sell it for a Montage M7.

[tomzi]

Also immediately loved having the no external zone with program changes back to control other keys per song. Nord even took that out of the newest revision of the manual. .

It does work, "TvR69" figured it out and posted it:

I thought I had to use the external synth engine to do this (and sacrifice a synth) but you can send a program change for each synth engine (on three different midi channels) in the background to external gear by setting the program change information in the extern settings (next to midi) for each program and switch send on load to on. This does work even if your synth engine is on Analog, Samples or switched off.

Here is the Thread: nord-stage-forum-f3/send-program-change ... 24431.html

[Mr. Marko]

So glad I stopped by here and stumbled onto this info - I think I will go check out a NS4...still using my NS3 and will not sell it...

It does work, "TvR69" figured it out and posted it:

I thought I had to use the external synth engine to do this (and sacrifice a synth) but you can send a program change for each synth engine (on three different midi channels) in the background to external gear by setting the program change information in the extern settings (next to midi) for each program and switch send on load to on. This does work even if your synth engine is on Analog, Samples or switched off.

[EricBarker]

I'm absolutely shocked that Nord removed the Song Mode. I've been using this method of patch management on my laptop since 2011, and it completely changed the way I setup my performances, in a far more musical direction. On stage, less of my brain juice is going toward "where is that patch, again?" and just go "next" and I'm there. If anything, after the Stage3 I was hoping for them to beef up the Song Mode structure. I'd love to see more emphasis on custom tweaks of patch instances inside Songs: Levels, Clock BPM, Octave Transposition... it would be great to use that same lead patch for a rocker and a ballad, but turn down the volume, and for the sync'd delay to change tempo to the new song. Software-based keyboard performance has been doing this for years, and I suspect other companies as well. They're exactly the kind of performance simplicity that I THOUGHT Nord was going toward. But I think they seriously dropped the ball on the Stage4 instead of pushing the Song mode even further.

[jonilikeskeys]

I wanna say: I don't get the problem at all.

I jumped from a NS2 towards a NS4. Well - I never had Song Mode obviously.

What what I understand is this:
There are "Songs" that reference existing programs to be a verse, chorus, bridge, whatever, right? Your specific piano sounds becomes the chorus sound of Song A and the bridge sound of Song C - something like that.

Basically these are two layers of programming, right? Songs --> reference --> programs.

The Stage 4 chose a difference approach in my opinion and didn't "just" kill Song Mode.
This time you get programs and layer presets. The layer presets can be called up within the programs one time (if you change the program afterwards, that won't change the layer preset, but the layer preset can be updated).
Again - you have two layers of programming: layer presets (individual setups for Organs / Piano / Synth) --> can be called into --> programs.

I know there's no 100% comparison, but let's stick to this for a moment:

This is how I work on my NS4:

• I try to squeeze one song into one program. With all morph-possibilities, Layer Scene I + II and all splits, I really have a lot of possibilities. If one program is not enough, I create a couple of them in a row.
• All of may favourite sounds (like my best piano, my best synth pad, my optimal organ and so on) I save as layer presets. (Which is AWESOME coming from a NS2!!!) Putting together a program for a song is MUCH faster than on NS2. I wonder how often I did configure the B3 the same way on the NS2 to match my needs.
• I'm not sure if that was available on the NS3, I think so: I can rearrange programs ON the keyboard ON the fly. Whenever I receive the setlist, I just quickly change the order of the songs (well technically programs). Swap and Move is possible - that's even better than Nord Sound Manager, which is annoyingly only able to Swap! Now, I don't need a laptop for quick re-arrangements of the setlist. GREAT!
• After each song I move to the next program - the next song. It saves the name, the BPM, I even sometimes store the key within the songs name, just to be sure.

This whole thing is totally clear to me. I feel like many people complain about losing the Song Mode and haven't even thought of arranging their stuff within programs and calling up their favourite sounds via layer presets. (alright - they can not be combinations of multiple instruments within NS4, but that's not a big thing in my opinion)

I just wanna say: I have absolut 0 problem getting through gigs like that. I actually love it.

[Valpurgis]

Coming from a NS2 to NS4 I would be a bit careful dismissing those that miss the Song Mode of the NS3. I am missing it, it was very convenient for my use and arranging programs like you propose only partially fix it and is quite cumbersom. I think enhancing layer sceen II to be fully independant from the main scene would help quite a bit.