Comparison of raw sawtooth of Lead A1+4, Stage 3+4, Wave 2

[analogika]

Here is a comparison of the raw single sawtooth waveforms of the Stage 3, the Wave 2 and the Lead A1 (using the "LP M" filter and of course cutoff fully open). It clearly shows the audible differences between them.

When I owned the NLA1 together with my Stage 3 I noticed immediately that the sawtooth of the A1 sounds a lot buzzier than the one of the Stage 3. This led to a more aggressive sound with a more "classical moogish" character.
In the meantime I sold the A1 and bought a Wave 2, and so it was interesting to see that the sawtooth of the Wave 2 "looks" quite the same as the A1 (they also sound quite identical).
According to the analyzer the Wave provides even a bit more volume at the low end.

In the analyzer graph the colors are:
- Lead A1: white
- Stage 3: orange
- Wave 2: blue

SAW waves Lead A1_Stage 3_Wave 2.png (213.21 KiB) Viewed 3096 times

[23skidoo]

I'd want to see that on a real spectrum analyzer and not on a plugin before I took it as gospel. From that graph you've got more or less just noise at 30dB down from 4k on up, not further harmonics. The sawtooths don't sound "noisy" at all, so I doubt that that's entirely accurate, you should either see the continuation of harmonics or the noise floor at that point, and the Nords don't have a noise floor of only -30dB.

That said, the only real difference is in that "noise" in the band edges, suggesting that the bulk of the waveform is identical. Probably the stage 3 uses a more aggressive BLIT or shorter wavetable with greater antialiasing. This might be to save either memory consumption or compute power. However in the "meat" of the waveform they're identical enough.

Based on it, though I'm by no means sure it's telling us an accurate story, if you want more fizz and hiss on the stage 3, use the EQ and crank the highs (or add some filter resonance with the filter nearly wide open). Otherwise it's identical.

Edit: Thinking about it, did you check the envelope settings on the stage 3 too? If you had any envelope applying, it would also round off the high end like that by ducking the filter when you didn't expect it to be closed down slightly.

[Nordlicht]

I'd want to see that on a real spectrum analyzer and not on a plugin before I took it as gospel.
Edit: Thinking about it, did you check the envelope settings on the stage 3 too? If you had any envelope applying, it would also round off the high end like that by ducking the filter when you didn't expect it to be closed down slightly.

Of course, everything was "INIT", so no envelopes, filter open, no resonance, no EQ, no FX or anything other.

The analyzer plugin I am using is a professional tool (developped and used by the HOFA recording studio) and it shows the actual audio spectrum in real time. The graphs shown are the peak values ("peak hold).
What you see is what you hear, especially regarding the massive drop with the Stage 3 above 7 kHz - I'm sitting in front of the Stage 3 and the Wave 2 and can hear exactly what the curves are showing. The Stage's SAW sounds quite dull compared to the Wave (and the NLA1).

[Hlaalu]

Of course, everything was "INIT", so no envelopes, filter open, no resonance, no EQ, no FX or anything other.

Did you select "prog init" and then choose synth, or did you select "sound init" within the synth?

The former does not reset the synth parameters if they have been edited, only the latter does.

[Nordlicht]

Of course, everything was "INIT", so no envelopes, filter open, no resonance, no EQ, no FX or anything other.

Did you select "prog init" and then choose synth, or did you select "sound init" within the synth?

The former does not reset the synth parameters if they have been edited, only the latter does.

All sounds were total initial sounds with just one single sawtooth, "Mini" filter and no further editing. I the case of the Stage 3 I did the "double INIT" (program and synth).

[Nordlicht]

And for the sake of completeness, here is the frequency response of one single "Pure Saw" from the Stage 4, like all of them without filters, effects, EQ, envelopes, unison, etc.

The curve (the red line) is quite similar to that of the Wave 2, only the bass area is less pronounced. The only one that drops significantly in the treble (this is also audible) is the Stage 3.

Nord SAW Waves comparison.png (238.24 KiB) Viewed 2756 times

[gitarrenzupfer]

Interesting. It would be cool to compare an identical wave sample on Wave 2 and Stage 3 / 4 in terms of frequency response. Maybe the Stage 3 generally has less bass/treble due to other DA converters. Just a thought...

[LeftyBass68]

Sawtooth done right.30 OSCS do sizzle more than the Nord by itself.Stage 2EX has a nice sawtooth and so does the Stage3.
Not as buzzy as the Behringers .Visual graphs are interesting for the eyes and not for the ears.
No graphs here,just audio.

[pterm]

And for the sake of completeness, here is the frequency response of one single "Pure Saw" from the Stage 4, like all of them without filters, effects, EQ, envelopes, unison, etc.

The curve (the red line) is quite similar to that of the Wave 2, only the bass area is less pronounced. The only one that drops significantly in the treble (this is also audible) is the Stage 3.

Nord SAW Waves comparison.png

The Stage 3 high end drop suggests that rise/fall time of the "vertical" part of the Stage 3's saw differs from the others. This could indicate a fundamental difference in the synthesized waveform or that the recorded output channel lacks the power to drive the "vertical" parts sufficiently fast or else the channel filters out the high end.

Do you see this same spectrum for Stage 3 across all its output channels?

Thanks for presenting this. I found it interesting and fun to think about.

[Nordlicht]

The Stage 3 high end drop suggests that rise/fall time of the "vertical" part of the Stage 3's saw differs from the others. This could indicate a fundamental difference in the synthesized waveform or that the recorded output channel lacks the power to drive the "vertical" parts sufficiently fast or else the channel filters out the high end.

Do you see this same spectrum for Stage 3 across all its output channels?

I checked all instruments with a stereo setting using outputs A and B (although the single saw is mono).

Unfortunately I can't du further tests with a Stage 3 as I recently sold it.