Sending MIDI CC is SO slow (FIXED dw)

[mudpuppy]

i've got a nord rack 3 with MIDI OUT connected to my MIDI interface with ableton running.

whenever i arm a MIDI track and twiddle with the knobs on my rack, the CC messages are just PAINFULLY slow. ill do one full sweep of a knob and the red LED will have only moved like a quarter of the length. why is this? is sending MIDI CC from hardware synths always this slow? dodgy cables?

first time nord rack user here. very new to setting up hardware in general. i do most of my stuff in the box

edit: fixed it by turning "MIDI Local" to "Off". I'm actually still not 100% sure why it works lol.

If i understand this right, with MIDI Local to "Off":

• I press play on Ableton

• I turn a knob on my Nord

• The MIDI CC is sent from my nord

• Ableton immediately sends back that CC value to my Nord

• That is what actually changes the sound

is this correct? my brain is tiny and thats my understanding from the manual

[23skidoo]

Ok, first of all, this isn't unique to Leads/Racks, or even Nords. It's a generic MIDI / synth question and applies to all MIDI controllable instruments when used with a DAW. Since you don't understand MIDI fully yet, it's understandable that you'd be asking the question relative to the synth you have. But I might flag this for another sub-forum because it's a bit off topic here.

That said, I'll do my best to answer it:

"MIDI Local" (or the generic term "Local Control") is just a toggle that either connects the panel knobs and switches to the synth parameters AND CC generation (ON), or only to the CC generation (OFF).

If turning local control to OFF still lets knob movements take effect, then you must also have a cable from your MIDI interface to the MIDI IN on the NR3, which you don't mention, and your DAW is clearly also set to monitor and repeat the MIDI back to the synth.

My guess, and since there isn't enough information here to do more than that, is only a guess, is that you have a MIDI loop because your DAW is always echoing the values sent to it back to the synth in addition to sending whatever was recorded into the sequence. When Local Control is ON, this can make changing values on the synth difficult because it takes a meaningful amount of time for the CC message(*) to propagate from the synth to the computer and back. What can happen looks like this:

1. You turn the knob. In the fraction of a second it takes you to turn it a degree or two...
2. The synth internally recognizes the knob moved and updates the internal parameter value.
3. The synth also generates a CC message corresponding to some intermediate position of the knob. This is sent out the MIDI OUT.
4. Ableton reads the MIDI intermediate value and then passes it to the output channel and interface of the track (which in this case is probably right back to the NR3)...
5. You've moved the knob a bit further now (remember this happens in tiny fractions of a second) and the synth generates another CC for the next position, but in the meantime...
6. The reflected MIDI value from step (4) comes back to the synth with the CC value for the previous position.
7. The parameter (and "effective" knob position) is updated to this older value, stepping the virtual knob backwards and making it look like you haven't moved the knob hardly at all.

Repeat for every step, you go back very nearly as much as you go forward which is why it seems slow, but it isn't.

By turning Local Control OFF, you have broken the first step of that loop - the synth does not update its internal parameters or knob positions when you turn the knob, but only when it gets the reflected values, so you never step "backward".

Local Control OFF is the correct state for a synth to be in when doing a recording session where the DAW is both mirroring back and playing back the CC messages (in fact, that is why this option exists at all!). However, if you want to use the synth without the DAW, or if you turn off the midi monitoring in the DAW for that track (or any/all tracks that use that synth) then you'll need to turn local control on again or the controls won't do anything but generate CCs that go nowhere.

(*) The parameters that the encoders control are not CCs, though moving a knob can generate a CC message, and receiving CCs can change the position of one of the parameters, and thus affect the visual "position" of the encoder. CCs are simply a type of MIDI message that can be mapped to a variety of meanings across a variety of contexts. It's important not to confuse them for parameters (the actual internal value of a control on a synth) or the encoder/knob that affects that parameter (and may or may not also generate a CC message outbound).

[mudpuppy]

absolutely legendary explanation thank u v much exactly what i needed for my monkey brain