Inside Triple Pedal, modification

[Hanon_CTS]

Hi Hanon,

I think you are reading them upside down

2001 vs 1002
1022 vs 2201

I guess that's what happens when you get old

What happened to the good old days when everything ran off of steam?
Stupid electricity!

[rick88]

Great photos and interesting work, but there seems to be an incomplete understanding of how this works in the above thread. Clearly, that rubber contact switch bears a strong resemblance to the rubber contact switches Fatar uses in their keybeds. The dual nature of the switch is created to provide velocity data to the keyboard's brains.

Stomp on the sustain pedal really really hard (when connected to NP88 or NS2 with grand piano selected) and one will hear the dampers lifting from the harp and resulting resonance of the entire harp. Step gently on it and one doesn't hear that. The resistances have not changed, but the sound has. Hmmm...?

Fatar commonly uses those same switches in all their ordinary sustain pedals, no doubt because they already have a huge supply of them for their keyboards, but it seems pretty clear from the evidence that the Nord pedal actually USES the dual-contact arrangement to convey velocity info to the Nord (probably the first and only sustain pedal to do so?).

This is not top secret info from Nord, just the product of physical evidence and simple deduction from the pedal's behavior and design...

Bless,

Pablo

[WakemanFan]

The dual nature of the switch is created to provide velocity data to the keyboard's brains.

Stomp on the sustain pedal really really hard (when connected to NP88 or NS2 with grand piano selected) and one will hear the dampers lifting from the harp and resulting resonance of the entire harp. Step gently on it and one doesn't hear that. The resistances have not changed, but the sound has. Hmmm...?
Bless,

Pablo

Hi Pablo,
Thanks for pointing this out as Hanon_CTS did over 4 months ago.

To all,
I've been watching this thread with great interest, thanks for breaking down the mystery of the NTP for us.
The Sustain pedal appears to be velocity sensitive as well, with early, and late making contacts (probably for the stomp feature).
Merry Christmas, Hanon

Still glad that you're participating on the forums though

regards, wakemanfan

[rick88]

For anyone who would like to try some DYI (disclaimer: at their own risk!) and on a request from Johannes and other forumers in this thread, I have made a schematic of the Triple Pedal wiring, based on this discussion.

schemeit-project-2.png (22.71 KiB) Viewed 7465 times

Based on that I have attempted to modify a FATAR VFP-3 and implemented SOSTENUTO, SOFT and also the SW2 part of DAMPER, just using basic wiring and existing switches which are 3 (one per pedal) of the same membrane-type ones as in the triple Pedal (with some modification of the Damper switch, as you have to separate the low and hi part of the switch which are originally wired together in the VFP-3, to make it act as a single switch).

That of course doesn't make it 100% like the original Triple Pedal, particularly as Dynamics are concerned (but I don't care since I am not fond of Piano Pedal Noises), still it works perfectly as Soft/Sostenuto and fine enough as "semi-continuous" Damper (even if Half Pedaling is of course less precise, compared to the original, since it is being triggered too low = only by SW2, i.e. for NS2/NP2 it is as if SW1 was "closed in a nanosecond")

I have also added a 2 way switch to route back the SOFT pedal to the separate MONO jack of the VFP-3 and use it for the Rotor/Latch input

[Mr_-G-]

Thanks maxpiano. I suppose that the one you modified is the fatar FVP-3/10 (normally open)? There is also a 3/15 which is "normally closed".
And there is one Fatar triple pedal that also has a pot in the sustain, but not sure it is one of these. Does your have it as well as on double bubble?
And what is your conclusion about the function of SW1 in the damper. Only pedal noise?

[maxpiano]

Thanks maxpiano. I suppose that the one you modified is the fatar FVP-3/10 (normally open)? There is also a 3/15 which is "normally closed".
And there is one Fatar triple pedal that also has a pot in the sustain, but not sure it is one of these. Does your have it as well as on double bubble?
And what is your conclusion about the function of SW1 in the damper. Only pedal noise?

Correct, it is the VFP3/10 (normally open, as in the schematics); I have come to no final conclusion about the "side effect" of not having implemented the SW1 in my adapted VFP3, from a player perspective (at least mine) as long as I keep Pedal Noise switched off the rest seems to work fine, but it is possible that the net effect is to have no dynamics and probably no half pedaling, so same behaviour as the on-off standard damper pedal.

[maxpiano]

PS: no pot in the VFP3-10, not even the plastic supports for adding it, at least on mine.

[with657]

Correct, it is the VFP3/10 (normally open)

Hello, can someone confirm this?
Thomann Web say Fatar VFP-3-10 is "momentary open" switch, which means "normally close"

http://www.thomann.de/gb/fatar_vfp310.h ... ddba1262f5

I think I have idea to make fake Nord triple pedal. I will post the progress..

[maxpiano]

I already confirmed, also because I own it. The normally closed is the VFP3-15 and not the VFP3-10, Thomann is wrong.

[with657]

Ok. I believed so.. I just want to doulbe check before ordering. Actually I inquired to Thomann, but they answered their information is correct. weird...Chan