Nord User Forum

The half diminished scale is in fact what it's usually called a half whole Scale or dominant diminished (instead of diminished dominant). It's a scale you play on any chords with a #9 or b9. It comes from the rules of improvisation with modes.
Thus, in A (I take A because it's the relative minor of C, and all the dominant diminished, diminished dominant, melodic Minor and so in, are the second part when you learn mode in basic jazz courses on improvisation....) is Half step, then whole step, then half step etc....
So, A, Bb, C, Db, Eb, E, Gb, G and A
To be more precise, on a Am7, a IIm7, you would have played Dorien which is the major scale one step below the chord, so, G major.p, G, A, B, C, D,E, F#, G
But on an Am7b9, you play dominant diminished.....the one that I described above.
If it would have been a Diminished chord, which is a minor chord where the 5th and the 7th are diminished, play diminished dominant, Called also whole half step..so on a chord which is .A, C,Eb, Gb (noted Adim or A0) you play A, B, C, D, Eb, F, Gb and A again....
If it's a semi dinimished chord, which is in fact just the 5th that is diminished (A, C#, Eb, G), or also any 7th chord with a b5th, just play Locrien.
Finally, yes, your example is tasty, because usually, on an altered chord, which is a chord with a #5 AND a #9, you usually play melodic minor half step above the chord.
That's it
Don't worry, this is just a start to help you find the right scale to improvise but after some time you will hear in your head what notes are correct to play in any mode....and back sometime to rules when you hesitate... miles Davis, blues in green or Bill Evans Sometme ago or both of them playing Someday my prince will come, or blue Bossa ( when you are fade up of the blues scales....) are good example of songs where you can use the scale above.

If anyone is following this thread and interested in this stuff, I found the following video a really nice start to explaining how to spice up some of the notes you play over the V:

I am trying to master some of this to make my playing more interesting!
Any other tips for getting more colour into your playing?

Super, thanks a lot, I had found the YouTube video of this guy, I recognized him but was not able to find them again last time I wants to check....I will save the link...

Half diminished scale, or Locrian mode, is the seventh mode of the major scale, ie play all white notes starting on B.
Formula... 1 b2 b3 4 b5 b6 b7 8

Quai34 wrote:Finally, yes, your example is tasty, because usually, on an altered chord, which is a chord with a #5 AND a #9, you usually play melodic minor half step above the chord.
That's it

Doesn't a b9 also qualify as "altered"? I thought "altered" meant that it's played from the altered scale (i.e. Melodic minor VII), which includes both the b9 and the #9, as well as the b5 and #5.

Incidentally, the whole note-half note scale you describe above also works for altered chords.

Don't worry, this is just a start to help you find the right scale to improvise but after some time you will hear in your head what notes are correct to play in any mode....and back sometime to rules when you hesitate... miles Davis, blues in green or Bill Evans Sometme ago or both of them playing Someday my prince will come, or blue Bossa ( when you are fade up of the blues scales....) are good example of songs where you can use the scale above.

I like to think of them as "options", not "rules".

The only "rule" I consider valid is "if it sounds good to you, it IS good."

The twentieth century, starting with Schönberg and his ilk, was all about establishing that any of the twelve notes are fair game. Everything else has been about exploring possibilities and finding ways to discover them, and use them to various effects.

Which is to say: study them, practice them, until they become second-nature. But don't worship them as if anything else were "wrong".

My teacher used to like to say that there are many rules in music, the first of which is:

1) there are no rules

More importantly, I have to wonder what Schönberg's ilk would have thought of being described as an ilk...